The Rise of US Women’s Cross Country Skiing & Being a Professional Athlete and Advocate for Climate w/ Jessie Diggins | Koopcast Episode 148

Hello, trail and ultra people. Welcome to another episode of KoopCast. I am your host, Stephanie Howe. Jason Koop is still out on his adventure. Today I have a special guest, Jessie Diggins. Jessie is an amazing cross-country ski racer who hails from Afton, Minnesota. She's the most accomplished cross-country skier in the history of the sport from the United States. She is a three-time Olympian. She has multiple World Cup and World Championship medals. She's been on the podium of the Tour de Ski. She's won the Tour de Ski in 2021 and was the first female to medal in the Olympics in cross-country skiing and is all around an amazing person as well. Today I had the opportunity to sit down with Jessie and talk to her about her growing up in Minnesota and how she transitioned to become a professional cross-country ski racer, talk a little bit about the training and what it's like, and then talk about her rise in cross-country skiing to become the most decorated athlete in the sport. We also talk about skiing and winter sports in a

changing climate and a little bit about Protect Our Winters and what it means to her to be on the board of Protect Our Winters and to be an athlete advocate. So I hope you enjoy our conversation today. Here is Jessie Diggins. Hello, thanks for having me. Yeah, I'm so glad we could figure out a time to chat. And we're actually both in Park City right now, which is really random because we both don't live here. I know. We're probably like less than five miles away from each other right now. Yeah, yeah. And we were just chatting offline that it is gorgeous right now. The leaves are changing. It's a crisp fall day. You just did a great workout. I hung out with Julian at a coffee shop, but it's like a perfect day in Park City.

It's so nice. The training weather here is amazing. We're sometimes it get a little rainy, a little slippery on the roads and other places. So we're really lucky to be here. Yeah. And I was just thinking before this podcast, where I actually don't know where is home for you right now? It's such a good question, because honestly, the honest answer is probably out of my suitcase, because I'm on the road probably six months out of the year. What with the World Cup being almost exclusively in Europe from November through March. And then we have so many camps in the summer. But in April, I live out of Boston, which is where my husband lives and works. He works for Credit Swiss. So he is pretty tied to being in the city. But then my club team trains out of Stratton, Vermont. So that's three hours away. So we do a lot of commuting back and forth. But yeah, that's that's sort of my, my three homes are my suitcase, Stratton, Vermont, and Boston.

Nice. Yeah, those are those are all lovely places, the suitcase, especially I know that well. Um, it's, it's a really great thing to be able to travel and just be in different places, different countries, but it does get exhausting, especially when you're trying to train and be in a routine. So I'm really glad we could grab you in in some of this transit right now. I know you were just in the Bay Area, which is where I am right now. And now we're both in Park City. So yeah. Yeah, that was that was really cool. We were doing this women's only running race with Solomon, and you would have loved it. It was amazing because it they had free childcare, they had lactation stations, they had amazing food, drinks, like everything, but it was just like, all aimed at making women feel more comfortable in sport and also being able to race. So if you're coming back from having a kid, you don't have to choose like that makes it like, hopefully you don't have to like rocks at paper scissors with your partner, like who's gonna watch the kid and who gets to race this weekend. So it was honestly so cool to be a part of it was really empowering.

Got me fired up and yeah, very cool. And kind of the first of its kind. So hopefully there's there's more of those it gets the ball rolling. Yeah, I think the standards being set. So that's yeah, that's yeah, it's a great thing. So I wanted to just go through a little background with you. I mean, well, let's kind of start from the beginning. I know, actually, we are from very similar places. You grew up in Afton, Minnesota, and I'm from Forest Lake, Minnesota. So our high schools were rivals in cross country skiing. Although I think you raised my brother. I was I don't think we overlapped as much though. I don't think so either. You were a little seventh grader. I think when I was graduating, I remember hearing your name like, oh, Jesse Diggins is gonna be a really good skier. And turns out those predictions came true. But you grew up in Minnesota where cross country skiing is a huge part of the culture. I think a lot of a lot of people don't understand that in Minnesota winters, there's not much else to do. So it's kind of something that everyone does. But I'm just curious, when did you start? Like when did you start skiing?

And when did you know you wanted to be you wanted to race and be a, I guess, professional cross country skier? I mean, that's a great question. Because I started skiing really young, because my parents both cross country ski. So my my dad was introduced by his hockey buddies, because he grew up playing hockey in Canada. He's Canadian. And he was playing with a bunch of Finnish kids in Thunder Bay. And they were like, hey, you got to try this thing, right? Because they're all Finnish. Of course, they all cross country ski. It's a very Nordic sport. And so they got him into it. And then he met my mom and was bribing her to go out skiing with like wine and bread and cheese picnics on the ski trail, which really worked. So she got into it. She was like, Oh, this sport is great. Like, this is really fun. It's really social. Like, it's a cool way to challenge yourself. And you know, there's low injury risk. It's just, it's a really fun way to spend your time outdoors in the winter. So I grew up with my parents just loving everything outdoors, like camping, hiking, fishing, canoeing, like very Minnesota upbringing, like going up to the boundary waters, like that sort of thing.

Um, so in the winter, they would just stick me in their backpack when I was a baby and keep skiing every weekend. And so I grew up thinking like, Oh, it's super normal. Like everyone just goes to a different park every weekend, and like hangs out at the lodge and skis all day. Like I kind of thought like, that's what you do, of course. Um, I think a lot of people do actually do that in Minnesota. So then I joined the high school team. But um, up to that point, I had just been doing like citizens races. Um, you know, like the Berkey, the Cordelope, the Moravos Lope, like these really fun races where it was like, Oh, like, I don't know if I can ski 25k, but I want to try. And I'm going to like come to a full stop at every aid station, like skis and pulls off unwrapping Snickers bars, like just really in it for the experience and not necessarily in it for like diehard competition. Um, but then I joined the high school team and I was so dorky. Like I, I mean, I didn't occur to me that I needed to like tie my hair back. So one of the older girls, Maddie went would be like, come here, I'm going to braid your hair for you. And like that started my lifelong like hair braids on race day thing. And they really like, they really took care of me and took me under their wing. And the culture on the ski team was so positive, so welcoming, so inclusive.

Um, we had like 120 kids on the ski team. So it was so fun. Like you really felt like you belonged, like all my friends were doing it. And so that's when I really started being like, Oh, well, this is, this is where I fit in. Like, this is where I belong. And I'm going to start training more. And, um, the more I trained, the better I started to race. And the more I raced, the more I was like, Oh, we're score points for the team. Like to be so cool. And, um, so even though it is an individual sport, I really got into it because of that team atmosphere. And that's where I really kind of found that love and passion for racing and training, not just, you know, kind of putzing around in the woods, which I also love to do, but, um, yeah, that's kind of how I got into it. Yeah. It is such a great team sport. And I mean, running and skiing are very, very similar. They they're individual, like you're doing the sport on your own, but being part of a community is so important, especially in high school. And I can really relate to being a nerd.

I was on the cross country running team and the ski team. And those are my people, you know, you can be kind of an awkward endurance nerd and you fit right in. And I think having that group of people is so important. And as you get older too, that, that doesn't change. And if, um, you're, you're saying like in Minnesota, it's, it's normal to, you know, go outside, go skiing, go to the ski lodge. It's like, what else do you do in the winter? If you don't snowmobile, you probably ski either Alpine or cross country because it's cold, it's a long winter and there's a lot of snow generally. Well, we'll talk more about the snow situation later, but. Exactly. I was going to say generally, we'd like there to be more, but yeah. With an asterisk. Um, so you also had a lot of success, um, at, at a young age, uh, growing up, or I guess going through the, uh, junior high, high school ranks. Um, you were, when was your first, I don't remember if it was when you were in high school, uh, your first state title for skiing.

Oh gosh. Um, I want to say that was ninth grade. And then my 11th grade year, I couldn't race Minnesota state because I was representing the U S at world juniors and missed like qualifying. Cause I was over in Europe racing. So I came back and was a forerunner and was testing wax for my team. So it was so fun. Cause I was there and I was like, I'm going to contribute to the team. Like I'm going to be here for you guys. And it was honestly, I had so much fun that year because there was no pressure on me to race. I was just out like this kick wax works better than that one quick. Like I want to help so bad. So it was my, my only experience being part of the wax squad. Yeah. And probably really cool for your teammates to have you out there supporting them in that way to just coming back from, uh, you know, skiing at world juniors and then, uh, supporting the high school team. And I think, uh, you were, so I went to Northern Michigan, uh, university. That's, uh, the college I went to. And I, I know you were planning to go there, but you kind of came to this point where it was like, you were having so much success and you could become, I guess, a professional ski racer or do be part of the U S ski team. So what was that decision like for you?

I I'm sure it was kind of a tough one and ultimately decide to go the direction of the U S ski team. Um, yeah, it was not an easy decision because it was, um, really stepping off of this really nicely paved path, right? Like you go from high school, you go into the NCAA racing system. Um, you go get, you know, a full ride through sports. Like you get your education paid for because of sports. Like it was really, um, I, you know, had definite moments of doubt where I was like, am I insane for turning this down and following my passion of skiing full time. But, um, yeah, Northern Michigan was where I was going to go. Um, and I ended up applying also for an academic ride.

Um, so I wanted to make sure that I wasn't putting pressure on myself for it to be all skiing so that I felt like I was really, um, three-dimensional being. And ironically, then I didn't go to school at all. So, um, but I think ultimately it came down to, I just kind of realized some things about my personality and how I'm wired. Um, I'm really type a, um, I have a lot of perfectionistic streaks, um, which we see a lot in the endurance community, right? Like I'm not the only one. Um, but I kind of realized like, I, you know, they talk about like all the different things in, in sport, school, sleep and social, right? You can't have everything. Like you can't have a full bucket of all those four components. Something has to give because you just only have 24 hours in a day. And I realized I was going to really struggle with that. Like I wasn't going to be okay with not getting an A in every class. Like I, I wanted to ace every single test, but I also wanted to sleep eight and a half hours a night and be training 700 hours a year. You can't do all of those things, um, and have any semblance of a life. And so, or at least I didn't think I could. And so I ended up choosing skiing because I figured like schools are always going to be there. They're always going to take my money to let me come and get my degree. Um, but skiing at this level, training that hard, recovering that hard, that's kind of got a shelf life. And I really wanted to see how far I could take it. Um, and at that point I was 18.

So I didn't really know how far that would go. Um, I, I was focused on was fulfilling my potential within the sport. And I didn't really know if that was going to be, make the national team and make an Olympics or make multiple Olympics or win the Olympics. Like at that point, we didn't really know, but I was just like, I, I know that the way I'm wired, the only way I can do this with a really full heart and a clear head is if I go after it with everything I have. And that way, I'll never have a regret and never wonder like, what could I have done if I had like really gone after it with everything that I have. So, um, I was really lucky though, because my parents really supported that, which I mean, they must've thought at some, they must've had some conversations about like, I can't believe we're letting our daughter do this, but, um, they were like, yeah, we're going to support you. Like, but if you do choose skiing, you need to be a professional. Like this will not just be your job. It'll be your career. So you need to start fundraising. You need to start making pictures to sponsors, make a website. You know, they really helped me get my head straight about it. And they were like, if you're going to do this, do it. Like have it be your job, make it a career. So, um, I'm just so grateful for their guidance and help.

Yeah. Well, it sounds like you guys planned it out well, and I I'm very similar. I'm a type a personality, a little bit of perfectionist. Um, and I'm sure you, you planned it out and made lists and were very detail oriented about how you were going to do it. And I think that does make it, I mean, you are acting like a professional and like you said, it's, it's one of those things where you have this opportunity and if you don't try, you'll never know. And school's always going to be there. They will always take your money. There's always opportunities to learn, but being an athlete does have, there's like a time where it makes sense. And there's a time where it's a little bit tougher. And I know, especially with skiing, it's, you know, there, there's more that goes into it besides just being a fast or an incredible athlete. You have to have a team, you have to have support, you have to have a wax tech, you have to have sponsors. And so a sport like running, you can sort of shelf it for a little bit and pick it up as an adult and kind of seamlessly go right in, but skiing is different. And if you don't go through that pipeline, it's really hard to break back in. If I decided, Hey, I want to be a skier again, I would just be, you know, I would be doing the Berkey, which is fun, but I wouldn't have a shot at doing anything competitive because you have to be in that system. So I think that's a really incredible, incredible foresight to have as an 18 year old to kind of see that and be like, I need to take this opportunity.

And I know myself and I want to give it everything and it's really paid off. So it's cool to see that actual leap of faith to manifest as it has. Thanks. Well, and I also have to say, I, besides my parents being supportive, like I got so lucky, like that first year that I went pro, I ended up somehow by fate getting paired up with Jason Cork, who's been my coach, my entire professional career and my wax tech. And so like the odds of us finding each other and then that relationship just really clicking, like he understands me, how I train, how I think, how I recover. Like we just have such a great working relationship there. And so that, and like the other women on the ski team were so just like in high school, so opening, open and welcoming and just like really taking me under their wing. And, you know, cause here I was, I was the baby of the team for like six years. I was like, I was the youngest for a very long time.

And they really helped me do a lot of growing up on the road with the team. And that was really cool. Cause I think when you think about the highest level of professional athletics in different sports, that's not always the case that the veterans on the team are like, here's this dorky little nobody. We're really going to welcome her into the team, even though she might take our spot someday. It was just this, you know, it's always been, I think for us, this sense of like all ships rise when we work together and we, we all get stronger and better. And so, you know, we're looking to put together the best four by five really possible. So it's in everyone's best interest that everyone's at the top of their game. And I've always seen that and been part of that through high school and then the national team. And it's amazing to see that kind of that snowball keeps rolling and getting momentum. And it's, it's been really awesome to see. Yeah. And I think that's really apparent from the outside, seeing the women, us women's cross country ski team just rise up.

And it seems like it is snowballing and that you are all supporting each other. And like one person's success is everyone's success. And I don't think that's always the case. And I think that's really encouraging. And I think as a fan of the sport, it makes me really excited to see, especially just being a woman in sport. And this is a good segue to talk about this right now, but I think it's an exciting time to be part of cross country skiing and women's cross country skiing specifically, because if I think back to when I first started, there was Keegan Randall and she was, she was at the top, but she was the only woman who was really, I think at one time she was the only woman on the US ski team. Literally. Yeah. Like cut the women's team for a year. And then the next year she was the only one on it. Like there was almost no funding for women's cross country skiing. Which is so, so backwards and sad, but she, she held that, right? She was that token individual who just kept, you know, working hard and pushing.

And then it seems like, I'm not sure what year it was exactly, but maybe, uh, the social Olympics, uh, just like you saw a few more people and started to get more attention and the women, there was more women racing because I think before it was more focused on the men, at least from what, what I knew there was a big men's team, very small women's team. And that has totally changed. And I think for me, one of the turning points that was really, really cool to see was when you and Keegan won the gold medal in the team sprint. That was like a glass ceiling shattering of like, no US woman had won a medal. And I think the only medal had been Bill Coke from like the seventies. Yeah. It'd been like 42 years. So.

Yeah. And, and it's not like we suddenly learned more about how to train properly or, you know, how to, how to race better. You got better skis or better wax. I think it was the team component and you guys working together and building each other up. And since then you can kind of like earmark that, that medal and look at, look at everything that has transpired since then you've become an individual medalist two times in the last Olympics. And, and the other women are doing incredibly well too. It's just raising the bar. So what does that, like, what does that feel like to be a part of that? I mean, it's, it's really cool, honestly, because, and I also want to shout out to the men too, because we, we all travel and train together as one team, which I think is kind of unusual. Usually there's a bit of a split. Um, and so for example, at this camp, we have mixed team housing. So we have two different houses that we're going to have at this training camp here in Park city. And if everyone just mixed together and we really support each other and learn from each other. So I want to make sure we don't like totally leave, leave the guys not to drive.

But, um, but honestly, it's been so cool. Cause I joined the team in 2011 and that's kind of when we started building up with more and more women, like the depth was there. I mean, you had Holly and Liz and Morgan Aratola before that. And, um, Sadie, Ida, Sophia, like we, we really formed this really cohesive group. Um, and it was just really cool to see and, and cool because yeah, like we, like you said, we own each other's successes. So like this year, like when, um, so Julia and I were roommates, Julia Kern, and we were roommates all winter. And when she had this amazing race day, I think she got fourth in a world cup and she made the Olympics. I was more excited for her than my own race. And I won the race. And my joy and highlight of the day was like, she made the team. She made the team. This is great. Cause I've been watching her grind away at this since she was 16 and kicking my butt in speed work. You know, I was like, this kid is amazing. She's going to do something. And I've gotten to be her training partner and, and then live on the road with her. And then when you see somebody that you've witnessed them working so hard, you just, you just feel really pumped up about it.

Like it's really cool. And so, and then it, you know, it always comes back around too. So like, when I crossed the finish line at this last Olympics, after the 30 K I had, I had pushed myself so hard that I collapsed. I couldn't see, I wasn't breathing. Right. And Julia like hopped the fence and came to help take care of me. Cause she was like, she's not okay. I know what she should look like after a race and it's not this. And so I'm going to go help her. And so it's just, we really take care of each other. And that depth is there until on any given day, someone from the team is probably going to have a great day. And so even if it's not you, you're like, all right, I contributed to this group. You know, we all pushed each other in training. We've been working together all year. So when someone else has a great day, I own a piece of that success. And then when I have a great day, they own part of my success.

And so it's really this collective ownership of good races. And I think that's what really helps you through your own hard days and also help you through the days when, you know, yeah, if someone else does better, it's not, it's not just, um, a zero sum game, you know, it kind of turns it into more of this collective, like we are all trying to make us skiing the best it possibly can be. And that means sharing what we know, sharing what we've learned. Um, I've done a lot of talking with my younger teammates about, you know, like how to handle some of the pressures of this last Olympics, because it was weird and strange and very stressful with all the COVID stuff going on. And so it was like, you know, you, you really feel like you want to pay it forward because you gained so much from the generation that came before you.

Yeah. Yeah. That that's really cool. I feel the same in running of like, I had great mentors and want to pass it on to, and that really goes back to it. It is a team team sport. And when you do work together, you bring each other up rather than try to beat each other down. I think that's, you know, you, you, sometimes it feels like you're competing for spots, you're competing for places at times, which is true, but you can be friendly about it. You can build each other up and still be, you know, as competitive as you want when you're on the trail, but then, or on the track, but then when you, you know, step off, you, you're best of friends and teammates and, you know, that bonds you so much. Exactly. Like if you win, but you're an asshole and you have no friends, like it doesn't mean anything. Like, honestly, nobody cares. Yeah. Nobody cares. Like, but if you win and you're a gracious competitor and you helped lift other people up too, then they actually want to celebrate with you. And then it is meaningful, but celebrating by yourself would just be, it would be meaningless. There'd be no point. Yeah, exactly. It's like not, not something that, yeah, the bigger, the bigger, the group and togetherness, it just makes it such a, such a better experience to, to share. Absolutely. So I, I wanted to ask you a little bit about your training too, because I think there's a lot of similarities between trail running, trail and ultra running and cross country ski, ski training. There's a lot of cross country skiers who are excellent ultra runners. So my, my ploy after this might be to, to try to get you to,

to get into, be interested in, and try to trail ultra at some point. I think maybe you're going to retire from cross country skiing. Yeah. We should talk offline. But just tell us a little bit about your training. I think right now, if I remember fall is a really tough time because it's right before the snow falls, you're trying to get in, you know, hard intervals so that you're ready to race in a few months. But what does that look like for you? Yeah. So I guess the, the general kind of curve of our training season is April's off because we race November to March. So April is the month where, you know, if you've got any little injuries or little things, you take care of them, you rest your brain, you rest your body. You make sure that when May 1st comes around, you're excited to train, not just ready to train, but like you're pumped up about it. And that I think prevents a lot of burnout. Um, and also it's the month where you're like, you want to go play tennis, do it. Like you want to learn how to row, go do it. Like do it, do all the other things, like go camping for a week.

Like you can't do that with the way we train, um, any other time of the year. So, um, that's kind of where you just get everything out of your system. Um, and then starting May 1st, we start up training and it's kind of cool because we get to do so many different sports. So we actually spend a lot of time trail running. Um, and I think the one thing that's super different is, you know, runners are always like, Oh, like what pace do you run or how many miles? And I'm like, I have no clue. Okay. Honestly, I have no idea because we just do everything off of heart rate zones and time training. Um, so it's like, I might be like, all right, I need to go run for two hours at a really easy pace. And that's what I've got. And so I've no idea how many miles it's going to be or, you know, what the pace is going to be. It might be 12 minute miles. It doesn't matter. Um, so I think that's kind of fun because we're really relaxed about it. And we do a lot of training at a really easy pace so that when it's time to go really hard, we can go really, really hard. And so we kind of have very, um, there's like a sharp delineation between these zones for us. And then as we get closer to the fall, um, we're doing more and more roller skiing. So still doing some trail running, um, some spin biking strength twice a week and one extra core session. Um, so we're really trying to be pretty well-rounded because it's such a full body sport, but, um, yeah, it kind of skews towards like maybe one third to one half

in the spring and summer is roller skiing. And now it's like two thirds to three quarters of our training is roller skiing because it's more sports specific and kind of targets those same muscles and that same feeling. And then we'll go over to Europe, November 16th, have 10 days to beat the jet lag and get back on snow and get back into those feelings again for the first time. And then we're racing pretty much every weekend until March. Yeah. Yeah. It's a busy year. And if you think about 700 hours splitting that up over, um, different months and weeks, what does that look like? Like, do you have, how many hours a week do you train generally? Yeah. So at this point in my career, I'm training more like 850 hours. And so, but it's not the same every week, right? Because you have harder weeks and then easy weeks and you kind of want that wave, um, pattern. I'm like moving my hand. People listening to the podcast aren't going to see what I'm doing with my hands. So I should stop.

Anyway, picture like a really nice wave on a graph. And, um, yeah, so like this week is a recovery week. So it's going to be like 16 or 17 hours. It's a lot more easy distance with a couple of strength sessions and one interval set. Um, and then next week will be like 23 or 24 hours. And we're going to have a couple more intervals speeds, um, all the strength and everything. So we kind of alternate between harder blocks. And then after a couple of weeks of that, you have an easy week to kind of absorb it all and come back. Yeah. Yeah. One, one reason I think a lot of cross-country skiers make good trail and ultra runners because well, one most, well, not most, but a lot of ultra running is the same. You go for time. I don't care about miles or pace. It's like, does this feel easy?

You know, or does this feel hard? Like sometimes you can be running a mile and it's 18 minute miles because it's straight uphill or you're on a flat and it could be six minute miles. So it's kind of, that kind of goes away a little bit as well. But I think the philosophy behind Nordic skiing is, is a really rooted in good science. And the coaches have been, I had a great experience as well, just great coaches growing up and really instilling that work really hard and then work really easy and always take a rest day and make sure that you're, you know, you're strong, you're doing strength training. And I think a lot of running can just be one speed. I'm guilty of this right now. Cause I'm like, I have time go and I don't do anything too hard or anything too easy. I'm just right in the middle, which is the worst way to train. But I think when I'm serious about it, I go back to those, those things that I learned when I was a skier of like, your interval should be really hard, like really, really hard. And then when you're going for distance days, you should be able to hold a full conversation and they should feel almost too easy to some extent. And that makes a really good athlete because then you're not doing that middle ground that wears you out and you can go hard when you need to easy when you should. And the core and strength training, I think is, is something else that's really important too. And skiing is more of a power endurance sport, but that does come into play. I mean, in any sport as well, or any endurance sport, when you think about your week

and you're getting in all of those hours, does that usually like, do you do double days or is it like you kind of do like, is it all, do you do it all in the morning or do you split things up or what does that look like? We'll often split it up. Cause otherwise it would just be like four hours every morning or something. But usually, so like you said earlier, we always have a rest date, right? Because that's actually when the adaptations are made. And that's technically when you do get stronger and fitter because otherwise you're just breaking yourself down through the week. And so without that day off, you're not really gaining a whole lot. Um, so usually we'll take like Sundays or Mondays off. And then, um, the other six days we train twice a day. So it might be like today, it was like two hours and 15 minutes in the morning with some intervals. And then this afternoon I'll go run for an hour and 15.

Um, and so just kind of breaking it up that way is really nice. Cause then you have a chance to like fuel and rest and hydrate and make sure that you're really taking care of your body in between those sessions. So the other thing about how we train is those hours that we log is only your moving working time. And so the time that you spend doing any PT, any body care, any yoga technique, video, all that, that's like extra stuff on the side. We don't really like log that. So. And if you did, it would be like 10 more hours a week because that stuff takes time. And it's actually very important. I think it's easy to skip a lot of that, but yeah, it's like what keeps you going. So. Especially as I'm getting older, I'm like, okay, all right. Like how many double pull crunches have I done in my life? Like, I don't want to end up like the hunchback of Notre Dame. So I have to do a lot of like, um, strengthening in my upper back and shoulders to really pull those shoulders back and down so that I don't end up like slowly turning into a letter C. So this is a reminder to everyone listening, do your PT exercises. It's so important because you can't do anything if you're injured. It's like, it's hard. So it's, um, and a lot of what we get is these overuse injuries. So, um, it's like, it's easy for me to forget about it or want to skip it when things are going well, but that's when you have to be on top of it. So that's when you should be going well. And so it's kind of a funny cycle. Um, you mentioned taking care of your body and fueling and all of

that. And I, um, kind of, I don't know what I was going to say on the side, but what I do for work besides, uh, everything else is I do nutrition. And so I'd be remiss not to talk about that a little bit, cause it's such an important part of being an athlete. Um, I mean, being a healthy, happy individual in general, but when you're training that much at a high level, you have to have your nutrition dial to support that. And you've opened up a lot about, um, you know, eating and nutrition and your relationship with food and, um, you know, people can read your book and learn all about that and how you've really worked through that. But what have you learned about nutrition? Um, just as you've become, uh, like a professional athlete and, and how do you approach fueling, um, now? Thanks for asking about that. Cause it is so important to talk about because I think disordered eating is incredibly prevalent as our eating disorders, but a lot of people like at a subclinical level are struggling with a really tough relationship with food in their body.

Um, even if it's not at a point where they would maybe consider reaching out for help. And I think a lot of what I do is talk about that because it's, it can be such a taboo subject and it comes oftentimes with a lot of guilt and secrecy and shame when you're struggling with the relationship with your body and with food. And so, um, by, by making it not off limits, it makes athletes hopefully more able to talk to their coach and be like, Hey, have you read the book roar by Stacey T Sims? Like you should understand more about the female body and nutrition. Like this would be really great if we can have an open conversation about, you know, a really great plan for how I can have energy and make sure that I'm staying fueled and, and like you said, like happy and healthy and, you know, avoiding, uh, injuries that might come with low bone density and red S. So, um, so obviously I'm really passionate about this, but, um, yeah, I had an eating disorder when I was 18, 19 years old and I've been in recovery ever since. And so a lot of what I learned is like, that it's okay to eat while you're training. And so now instead of water in my drink belt, I've got, um, new hydration products. I'm making sure I'm drinking in some carbohydrates, making sure to eat during long training sessions. Um, and I've also really learned about the timing of an intake of nutrients. And so while I'm training, I want really easily digestible carbohydrates. So like, honestly, gummy bears are awesome because they just, it's super easy to get that sugar.

It doesn't mess with my stomach, but every body is different, right? So like every athlete has to experiment, like maybe one person does mashed potatoes. One person does bananas. Gummies work for someone else. Like everyone's kind of got their food that they know their stomach can handle during intense exercise or racing. Um, but then making sure I eat right after training as well to signal to my body, like I got your back. Like we got nutrients coming in, like making sure we're getting that protein, getting carbohydrates, getting some fats in there as well. And I think a lot of athletes are, um, kind of, well, not just athletes, like humans in the United States are very much conditioned to fear carbohydrates or fats, or now it's keto. Now it's this, now it's that there's all these different, um, fad diets that kind of come through every couple of years. I feel like we're due for a new one soon. I can't wait to see what it'll be. Um, cause it's going to be really interesting to be like, okay, like, all right, what else are we supposed to cut out now? But honestly, like my philosophy around food now is that all foods fit into a healthy diet. So, um, like before I went and did this really long, fun trail run this summer, I had a bunch of Parmesan truffle fries the night before. Cause I was like, I need to really make sure I am not hungry at all. And, um, I'm really enjoying this. And then just honestly, I really eat everything and everything in moderation too.

Right. Because if you subsisted only on carrots and vegetables, you'd also be in trouble. So I think like everything fits and just making sure that I'm eating enough and, um, really honoring and listening to my body's hunger cues, um, with the exception of really hard exercise, because then sometimes those hunger cues get suppressed. And then that's when it, you know, that's when you work with a dietitian to be like, let's come up with a plan. So I am meeting my energy needs. Even if I don't feel hungry in the middle of a run, I'm still going to have the banana anyway. Cause I know I need it. So. Yes. I love that you mentioned that. Cause that was my, my dissertation. I measured appetite hormones before and after different intensities of exercise and females. Um, and you're absolutely correct. Uh, appetite does get suppressed after especially hard efforts. And so making sure that you do eat, um, is really important. But what I like that you said is just making sure you have some sort of fuel, whatever that is for you to make sure you're getting the calories. Um, because a lot of injuries are from a macronutrient deficiency and mostly just energy, not necessarily like, Oh, I'm not getting enough protein, but I'm just not getting enough calories in general. And I think it's super common and diet culture really conditioned conditions us to think that's how we should think.

And it's not. And so I'm with you and I'm being really passionate about trying to spread this message of food is good there. You know, all foods can fit into a healthy way of eating and we need to eat to support what we want to do now and in the future. You know, we want to be living a long life and be, be healthy and eating is one way that we can control or, or ensure that we're, we're giving our body what it needs. So thank you for your leadership on that. It's, it's really great to have someone, you know, of your, uh, your status, talk about it and open up and be vulnerable. And also say like, you know, Hey, you have to do this if you want to be successful. And if you want to be an athlete and a human, um, you need to eat and take care of your body.

All right. I mean, and likewise, thanks so much for talking about it because it's sort of like, you wouldn't, you wouldn't try to drive your car without gas in it. Like it just, it doesn't work unless you have an electric vehicle, obviously, but you know, for the sake of the analogy, um, like you, you need to, you need to have the fuel in order to get where you want to go and to do the things you want to do and live a really happy life. And honestly, when people are hungry, that's why we have the term hangry, right? Like you get kind of angry when you're hungry. And like, it's like, you're just, you can't live the way you want to live when you're chronically deficient in, in nutrients and energy and calories. So, um, yeah, if you are a professional athlete, like work with someone, like come up with a plan to make sure you're actually getting what you need, because chances are, you probably need more than you think you need.

Um, like sport is kind of funny that way. Like if you had to guess how much energy you need, it's probably more. So I think that's where a lot of athletes get into trouble because they're really, it's not even on purpose. It's just that I thought I was, you know, I had one extra bar and it's like, no, we really need to be getting in nutrients while you're training as well. If it's a long session. Yeah. And it's cool just to learn too. I think about what you need. I think athletes are really in tune with eating and nutrition. And so it's cool to like know what you need specifically. So I will plus one that work with a sports dietitian or nutritionist to help you dial that in. Um, and I think when you do, when you find the right person to work with, they help you to see food as, as an enjoyable experience because it shouldn't be stressful.

It shouldn't be something that you have to measure or count or worry about or have anxiety about. It should be something you look forward to. And if that sounds unattainable, it's not like you can just flip a coin and get there, but it is possible to heal your relationship and have that weight lifted off your chest of feeling like, you know, you don't have to think about it so much. You can, you can have more mind space to worry about other things that are more fun or more important. I mean, yeah, I don't remember who said this, but it was like, just imagine all the things you could accomplish in your life. If the energy and time and stress you spent worrying about food could go into any other project, you know, your relationships, your friends, work, your passion projects. Like when you're struggling with food, it takes up so much of your brain space. Um, which is really frustrating. And that's the place that I was at when I was in my eating disorder. It was like, that was controlling my whole life, which is really sad. Um, because I didn't love myself and therefore I really couldn't love anyone else the way that they deserved. And so all my relationships suffered. Um, and I had to learn that I was worthy of getting help and that's okay. And I deserved it. So I guess I would say the biggest message I always want to tell people is if you are struggling with food, one, it's not your fault. Um, you know, we know that these are genetically primed, like there it's a mental health thing. So you wouldn't tell someone who struggles from depression, like, Oh, just be happy. You know, like it's not their fault. They were just born and

wired that way. Like, it's not something they did. They don't deserve it. And eating disorders work the same way. It's not like you just did something wrong and this is your punishment. You know, like you, you do deserve help. And the second thing is there's no, um, I'm using air quotes here. There's no sick enough to deserve help because one thing I hear from people a lot is, Oh, I would get help, but I'm not really sick enough to go see somebody. But we know that the sooner you go see a professional and the sooner you start working on recovery and healing that relationship with food and body, the better your odds are to have, to get better faster and live a really healthy, happy, long life. And so, um, like, don't wait, like there's never a convenient time. Um, you know, usually it's like, Oh, but I'm in the middle of school or work. But again, think of how much better you could do if that energy wasn't spent worrying and stressing about food. So, um, like it's, don't be scared to reach out if you, if it's at all possible, um, reach out for professional help.

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And, and give yourself some grace to knowing that you never just get to that. You never get to an end point. Like, okay, I'm good. I got it. Everybody struggles with food. We have to make choices about it every single day and it's okay not to be perfect and not to feel like you've totally recovered. So, um, thank you for sharing that. And I think that's really helpful to hear, um, coming from you as well. You know, that those are the two pieces that you've taken away. And, um, I think it is important. Like you said, that this is not something that you choose. It's, it's something that just happens and you can't really solve it on your own. So don't be ashamed of asking for help. And I'll say if anybody needs help, um, finding the right direction or just resources, please reach out. Um, I'm happy to, to kind of point you in the direction of, um, finding a registered dietitian or the right therapist, um, to help. So that's awesome. Um, yeah, well, let's, let's change gears a little bit here because I want to ask you about being a winter athlete in a changing climate. And I think one thing that really, I mean, there's a lot of things that stand out to me, but, um, we were talking earlier about Minnesota and how it's a winter place.

It's cold, it's snowy, but I remember even when I was in high school, my senior year, we had to ski at the, the Alpine resort. Um, we skied and it was terrible. We skied up and down the hill and this small little less than a kilometer loop on man-made snow because there was no snow. And subsequent years I've had some snow, but it's not consistent anymore. And it, it kind of alarms me as someone who loves winter of like our snow is melting and it, you know, watching the Olympics this past year, um, where you were in the high desert and it was just kind of crazy to witness. So like, this is just like this fake environment that they created because we don't have winter necessarily. So I'm just curious to hear about your experience being a winter athlete in this changing environment. Yeah. I mean, it's, I was smiling as you said that because not because it's something to smile about, but my high school experience was so familiar where we had some great snow years, but over the six years from seventh through 12th grade, like there were a lot of years where we had to drive to go ski up and down at like five 30 in the morning around the Alpine area before the lifts opened. And so we're in the dark with headlamps weaving around snow guns, trying to get in our training because we didn't have enough natural snow that even the golf courses where you need like an inch, two inches of snow to make it work. We didn't even

have that. And so, um, I remember just being really frustrated and being like, all right, like, you know, I, I, you know, you learn in school, like, okay, climate change is a thing, but you know, and you know, it's a problem. And I always, you know, believe the science of it. But then when you're face to face with like, I'm in Minnesota, we're like at the top of the country, we should have snow. We normally have snow. We always have a dependable winter season. And right now we don't for multiple years. That's really alarming. And it's sort of, um, I think the analogy that made sense to me is that, uh, winter athletes are often like the canaries in the coal mine, um, because we're really experiencing the effects of climate change. You know, it's changing the way we live our lives right here and now. And, but honestly, that's the craziest thing is everyone's experiencing it, whether they know it or not, like smoke season out West is getting crazy. As we're recording this, there's incredible crazy storms hitting Florida. We're having more and more severe weather events closer together. Um, and in higher extremes and you know, our world is changing. Everyone needs to breathe clean air and have a sustainable, like healthy planet to live on. So I think, you know, I, I really started to get involved with protect our winners because of the things I was seeing around the world. Like, um, you know, the story that really comes to mind every time is when we were up at the Arctic circle. Um, we were training in Rovaniemi, Finland, and it was, you know,

mid to late November. They, they always have early season snow there. It's super dependable. That's why we were there training. And we were skiing on man-made loops through puddles and dirt and then running back to the hotel, carrying our skis, wearing running shoes because we were on like green grass, mossy trails with like flowers blooming on the Arctic circle in November. Like that was super crazy. And honestly, super alarming to see that, you know, Santa's village was in the middle of a puddle. And, um, it was really scary to see that. And like last winter at the end of the year in March, I went to Chamonix with Solomon and we went up and did a little climbing. It was really cool. And the guides were telling me like, we've had to change our routes because routes that we've been doing for over a hundred years are no longer safe. And they had to replace the cables in the Guida Midi, that, that huge iconic, um, gondola ride up to the top because the water was freeze and it was going through some freeze thaw cycles inside the rock and it was shifting. And so one year after they redid the cables, they had to do it again, which is so scary because the, I mean, the fact that they're having to change like snow trekking and skiing routes that have existed for, you know, generations now we're suddenly having to change them all. That really is alarming to me. So, um, it was kind of a no brainer to join project our winners and, um, learn how to use my voice and

use my platform after the 2018 Olympics to say, all right, I really care about this. What can we do? How do we help? Um, because I tried doing nothing that didn't work. And so even though like, I, sometimes there is a lot of criticism and I'm sure you've experienced this too. Like we get a lot of people messaging me that, you know, claim to be on the same side, but they're like, I can't believe you would talk about climate change because you fly over to Europe to compete. Um, and so we get, we get a lot of that sometimes. So that's where the idea of imperfect advocacy comes in where, you know what, if you're doing the best you can, but your work needs you to travel. It doesn't mean that you're not allowed to care about climate change. You know, I don't know anyone who completely lives off the grid in a yurt growing all their own food. Um, I don't know anyone who exists like that in our world. And so we're all part of this. And so doing what you can and using your voice and advocating for bigger policy changes that are going to actually swing the needle as well as personal accountability, you know, in the ways that you can, that, that is worth doing. It's absolutely worth doing. And I think giving up or doing nothing because you're not perfect, that's so much worse. And so I think a lot of people are really scared to, um, openly care about climate change or want to talk about it or want to use their voice because they're like, well, but you know, I flew to see my friend get married and I had to fly across the country to do it.

And now I'm the worst person ever. But what if we could advocate for policy changes for a future where we can fly and we can travel, but with sustainable, um, fuel in a way that doesn't harm the environment. So I think that's what we're working towards. Yeah. And I really like the imperfect advocate. That's something that protector winters likes to, to, uh, talk about or promote, I guess, because we, we aren't expected, even if all of us lived off the grid and, um, nothing in our policies or in the way that we, uh, use fossil fuels changed, nothing would change in our current path with our climate. What it actually is going to take is, uh, policies and legislature that's going to roll back and going to protect and going to give credits for EVs and for solar and to transition to clean energy. That's, what's going to make a bigger impact. And placing that blame on the individual is something that those companies have done on purpose. Um, there's a podcast called drilled, uh, that kind of goes through how the fossil fuel industry paralleled the, the tobacco industry of putting that blame on the individual where actually, they knew this was a problem and they, you know, they're making lots of money.

They don't want to change what they're doing. And so they've, they've done a lot of marketing to make you feel like this is your problem. And that if you, if you didn't drive, if you didn't fly, if you didn't buy plastic, then, you know, we wouldn't be in this situation, but that's actually not true. We know that's not true. Right. Like I could quit my job and never fly again and nothing's going to change. Or if it takes the flight to DC lobby, help get that legislation passed and then things will actually change. So. Yep, absolutely. And, and I think that's what we're trying through Protect Our Winters to really get that message out that voting matters and your individual actions. Yes, you should absolutely do them, but know that to be part of systemic change, we have to work together and we have to vote in people, climate champions who are going to protect our environment.

And I think us using Protect Our Winters has really been kind of a platform for us to share this message. And it's been really incredible to, to have that resource because like you, there was a time where I was really frustrated. I didn't know what to do. I felt like this was such an important thing to me, but I didn't know how to get this message out. I tried volunteering. I tried joining other clubs and I just was donating money and it didn't feel like a way where I was really impacting change. And so Protect Our Winters, at least for me, has really allowed me to, to work and to do things that make me a little bit uncomfortable. Like lobbying is not always, you know, it's not always a comfortable thing to do. Calling my representatives, it's easy, but it's not always comfortable, but it makes me feel like I'm doing something. And so I think it's an incredible opportunity for any athlete, any person, any person who breathes air, which is everybody on planet earth, to, to advocate, to put people in office who are going to help us protect the environment because everybody likes clean water. Everybody likes clean air. And that's what we're asking for. It's really a nonpartisan issue where I think we have to make that clear. This isn't like a left or right thing.

This is like a humanitarian thing. Right. We're same team when it comes to climate. We need to be. I think it is interesting because I hear from a lot of people like, oh, but like I'm one vote. My vote doesn't really matter. But everyone says that everyone thinks that. And so it's like, yeah, your vote is like one drop of water. But if everyone goes out and votes, you make a waterfall. And that is very powerful. That can affect change. That can actually change the flow of things. So like, please, like make sure you are registered to vote. It literally takes less than two minutes. Like me and my teammates, we tried it. We like timed ourselves because, you know, competitive athletes and it's actually that easy and so fast. And then, you know, you can get your ballot sent to you if you're out of state. I mean, I'm sleeping in a different place every two weeks from now until March and I'm going to vote. I'm going to make it happen. There are no excuses. Like just making sure you're organized because it should be one of the top priorities, not just for climate, but like, I don't know if I'm allowed to talk about it on this podcast, but as a woman, I'm going to vote because I'm mad about things that have happened recently. And so if you're mad about something, vote because those huge changes do not happen if the people who actually share your values are in office, they can't, they can't pass things. And so you need to make sure that you're voting where your values are. And, um, I think it is, it is the single most effective way to make change happen

and make it fast. And, um, honestly, it was really cool. The last trip we took to DC this April, because, um, we spoke to people on both sides of the aisle, um, uh, house representatives and senators, Republican, Democrat, we spoke to a lot of people and they said, you know, this really does matter. Cause I was kind of like, Hey, you know, like as an aside, does this actually do anything when we come and talk to you about climate? And when people call your office and say, Hey, like, I really want to see you vote in such a way that you're protecting and you're a champion of climate in our planet. And they were like, yeah, it does matter. Like you've, they've got this huge to-do list, but every time you write, you call, you say, Hey, I'm so-and-so I live out in Nevada and I would really like clean air to breathe. I want to see you vote this way on this bill. It pushes it to the top of their to-do list. It brings it top of mind. So it actually does make an impact. It does make a difference. And so a lot of the times we're asking ourselves like, is this even doing anything?

But it really, it really does. And I heard that from both sides of the aisle. Um, and it was really encouraging because we had a reception with the Republican climate solution caucus and there were so many people, I think it was like 80 members of the caucus. Um, I'm, I'm guessing, I can't remember exactly what it was. So give or take like 10, but it was so cool to see that both sides of the aisle are saying, we recognize climate is a problem. We recognize it's man-made. We may not necessarily agree on how we're going to fix it, but we're of the same mind that this is a problem and we need to be thinking about this and communicating and we do need to work together on this. So, um, it was, it left me with a lot of hope and a lot of optimism that, Hey, like if we keep chipping away at this, things are going to happen. Like we can make this happen. It is possible.

Yeah. Yeah. And speaking up is so important. The representatives want to make their constituents happy. They want to be reelected. And so you, the single most effective thing, um, you can do to, to tell them is to call them. And I would encourage everyone to have the representatives in their phone, and just call them up. And, you know, anytime, I mean, I, I call mine all the time and it, you know, they, they mark down every time somebody calls, usually you don't talk to them. You talk to one of their aides, but they are taking notes and they can go then to the representative and be like, Hey, I had 10 people call about this climate bill and they are listening and they want to make you happy. And so I think that's really important to know that your voice is heard in that way and that they are, they are listening.

And they know that like you are the reason they're there in office. And if they don't make their constituents happy, they're out and they know that. So, yeah. Right. Right. And you don't have to really understand politics. I think that's the other thing people get intimidated by. I was super intimidated to call or to lobby because I don't fully understand the government and how bills are passed and how everything works in Congress. And it's confusing unless you have a degree or you've worked in that area. It's hard to follow their, like how things evolve. But what you can do is share your personal story because that is way more interesting and it's way it's obviously it's more personal and that's what they want to hear too. I'm sure when you went to DC and you told them about, you know, your, your experiences as an athlete and as a person, they're listening to that rather than you trying to remember bills and numbers and that sort of thing that that stuff they know and they're not as interested. So anyone who is wanting to connect or reach out, just be realistic and talk about what you see in your backyard. Like for me, when I was living in Bend, it was wildfire season every summer. And I found that there was less and less months out of the summer where I could go out and run and explore and do, I guess, my job or my, my hobby.

And there's so many people like that. Everybody has a climate story. I'm curious to you, what's your climate story? Oh, mine is just that we are competing more and more on man-made snow and venues can't even put in a bid to host a world cup unless they can prove that they can blow snow. Um, because we aren't able to count on normal season pretty much anywhere in the world. And so it's affecting not only, you know, it's like, Oh, boo-hoo. I don't get to ski for me. It's also, it's the health of our planet. It's places that depend on the snowpack melting to provide drinking water the rest of the year. It's places that depend on winter tourism to boost their economy. The whole town runs on people coming there to ski. And so we see this a lot of places all over the world, but I mean, I love what you said about, um, you don't have to be super in tune with the political side of things because I'm definitely not. And that's what I loved about working with protect our winners because they help make it really easy. They're like, Hey, if you join POW and go on the website, um, I remember them being like, Hey, this week we want people to, you know, call your representatives.

Here's the bill. Like we'll spell it out for you. We'll give you a template. We'll make it so easy. So you can do this in five minutes or less. You don't have to spend an hour Googling and researching you can, if you want to, but if you just want to make that call, we're going to make this so easy for you to get your voice out there and make yourself heard. And, um, that's what I really appreciate is that, you know, um, it doesn't have to be this big, scary thing where I'm like, I would, but I don't have like five hours to like research every nuance of this bill. So yeah, yeah. They really do the heavy lifting for you. Um, and anybody who wants to join team POW, uh, we, we encourage membership. It's a $20 for a year long membership. And if that's something that is just, uh, unaffordable, they will waive that fee. But when you're part of team POW, you'll get the information that we were just talking about with the campaigns and they really walk you through it. Like, Hey, here's what we're trying to do. Here's the phone number.

They even have a fault, a phone to call action. Uh, I guess it's a, an app or maybe it's a, I'm not sure what it actually is, but what you do is you just type in this number and it will actually call you and prompt you on what to say when you call. So it does it all for you. So you really don't have to understand. So I think that's a great resource to join team POW. And then for voting, we know the midterms are coming up and we know the midterms really matter. And to make sure that you're registered to vote, like Jesse said, takes less than two minutes. And you can go to stokethevote.com to find out more about, um, just voting in your area. Check if you're registered to vote and make a plan to vote because we know when people make a plan, they're much more likely to do it. And it can be fun. If you have mail in voting, you can get your friends together and kind of have like a voting party, which, you know, get a couple of drinks, get a pizza and fill out your ballots. And it can be something, I mean, it can be something done really quick too, but it doesn't have to be, you know, this thing that we picture going into a voting booth and being a stressful, not fun, uh, uh, event to do. Uh, but it does really matter. And your voice matters. The outdoor state we know is 50 million people.

And think about that. If we can reach that many people who like to recreate outside, who want to continue to recreate outside, whether you're a winter athlete or a summer athlete, or just someone who likes to breathe fresh air, if we can reach that community, mobilize them to get out and vote, we can really do a lot. So I appreciate you talking about that and, and sharing your story as a athlete. Um, and like you said, it, you know, skiing, having our snow taken away, that's, that's one thing. And that would be really sad, but it is bigger than that. That's like you said, the canary in the coal mine of like, it's most obvious here, but it's impacting every single person. Yeah. And I think making sure you vote, it gives you a feeling of empowerment too.

Like I'm doing something about this. Um, and I think that's, that's a really strong feeling. So I think, um, like you said, make a plan. Like I'm going to roller ski there. It's going to be part of my workout. It's going to be really fun. I don't know how many people roller ski into the pools, but I'm going to make it a thing. So I love it. I love it. You'll have to take some photos and share them. Um, yeah, well, thank you again. And this is going to be great timing because the, the midterm vote, uh, is coming out November and this podcast will come out before then. So you all have time to make sure you're, you're registered and to make your plan. And, um, Jesse, thank you so much for, for, uh, talking to me today and just sharing a little bit about yourself and who you are as an athlete and your goals. And we're really fortunate to, uh, well, I'm fortunate to have been able to, to get you on KoopCast today. So thank you so much.

And we wish you luck with, uh, your travel the rest of this fall. It sounds like you've got a bit more coming up, um, before you head over to Europe for the start of your season. Thank you. Yeah. It was an honor to be on the podcast and this is a really fun conversation. So thanks for having me. Yeah. Thank you. And, um, where can people find you? Um, we know you, you mentioned your website and, uh, Instagram, right? Yeah. So I'm just Jesse Diggins on Instagram. Um, my book is brave enough and my website is Jesse Diggins.com. All right. And I'll link those all in the show notes. Thank you so much. Thank you. All right. There you have it. What an incredible conversation. Jesse is such a humble guest and, uh, such an accomplished skier and is doing so much with her, her, uh, passions right now.

So thanks again, Jesse, for joining us and for taking us through your training, your background and sharing some of your, uh, struggles in the sport and with nutrition and opening up about that because I think it's really great to hear just from somebody who has gone through it and who is, you know, still working through it, but also has, uh, taken a pause and taken the time to get the help that they need so that they are able to continue to be a professional athlete. And I appreciate the work that Jesse has done with protect our winters and really being an advocate for climate. I think that work is so important. And if you'd like to learn more, like I said, stokethevote.com, uh, will give you all the information you need to make sure that you're registered to vote before the midterms and join team pal while you're at it. It's a great cause and keeps you up to date on everything that's happening in, um, climate policy, which is, uh, a very hot topic at this moment. So thanks again for joining us and thank you so much to Jesse for talking with me today and being on the pod.